How many people actually order a salad? I don’t think eating outside is cheap (Except at McDonald’s or a similar fast food joint). I prefer eating at home, because there are very few restaurants here that cater to my taste buds. I prefer independent restaurants compared to national/global chains because of the level of service and personalization.

People are too “busy” too cook here.

Subway food is very cheap-yes. That is exactly what I meant when I compared the 6 inch sub with a horrible salad at McD. I can customize my sub (remove cheese, ask for fat free mayo or skip it all together), whereas a McD salad is not customizable.

But overall, I guess McD does a good business out of adapting themselves to the countries in which they’re running their business. I totally dislike Dunkin’ Donuts. We don’t have Peet’s here. So don’t know about that. People here have never had a good cup of coffee- till date, I’ve had Starbucks coffee only four times. Like I said, I dislike these companies that have an outlet in every possible town or city.

You say: “And believe me, charging $6 for a small pack of salad is not cheap”.

This pretty much captures the essence of why McDonald’s can and will continue to make huge profits through their main products. The expectation of consumers to pay next to nothing for food, an absolute essential, but to expect the world, is so entrenched that it is laughable!

Some of it is down to unwillingness to pay; some of it is down to lack of awareness (increasingly the less important factor); some of it is lack of skills; some of it is sheer lazy-arsed-ness! Because for $6 or $10, people can buy a lot more food in American supermarkets and go home and spend 10-15 minutes preparing it and some more cooking it. But of course not.

BTW Subway’s daily special sandwiches - according to their very irritating TV advertising - cost about £1.99 here, which believe me is extremely cheap. UK is in general very expensive to live in. Just as a comparison - not of McD’s prices but a large contributory factor - our petrol and diesel prices are currently OVER £1 per litre (read that again if you will).

On menu options, it will surprise you to know that such as they do not serve beef in India, they do serve wine in France. French families are increasingly keen on McDonald’s! Their coffee and OJ in the UK are on par with other packaged instant offerings in those categories. If they are extending the menu choices, well they are only responding to the demand. Americans are spending larger and larger sums of money outside home (there are many NBER papers with stats and numbers which are eye-watering). So why not get some or all of it?

PS: On coffee, I am astounded at what passes for coffee in the US. Dunkin’ Donuts and Peet’s are two popular brands in MA for instance. Both are crap. Well, come to think of it, people see Starbucks as good coffee in America. What can I say? Last week it came bottom of taste tables in blind tasting in the UK.

I’m sorry for replying so late to this comment. Like you know, I had an Level 5 emergency (still do).

I agree with you on the count that organizations don’t function alone. Both the society and the culture that they operate in greatly influence the way they function. And yes, individuals need to be responsible for themselves. There are loads of ways by which they can become more informed.

Yes, I had no way of knowing what they would be eating- but their sizes gave them away. Plus, this is a country where people don’t know what ‘veggies’ mean. Nobody goes to McD to eat salad (except people like me) They can do that at a better place. I have tried to build a healthy meal around their menu and it doesn’t work. And believe me, charging $6 for a small pack of salad is not cheap. Their burgers and other meat items cost something in the range of $0.99-$2. So, I’m paying much much more for salad because I’m not their ideal client. Whereas in Subway, I can get a good 6 inch sub for around $4. And Subway is also McD’s competitor. Recently, when I was out of town, I had to stop there to use the rest room and because Mr. Pragati wanted to have a cup of coffee. And believe me, the coffee was YUCK. We threw 80% of it in the bin.

Did you read the Business Week article on McD that talked about how the company is expanding its menu options because Americans love eating out? They have special menus for 2 am meals, when lots of night workers are returning back. Then they have special menu for 6-7 am when people are on their way for work. They have introduced salad now because they want to serve everything people could want to eat. They don’t want people going to a restaurant for a salad because they lose business this way. This again reaffirms your previous statement that a company’s policies kind of reflect the environment they operate in. I’ll try to send you the link for this article. You’ll find it interesting.

I checked your blog post- it didn’t answer my question though. I could only find their customer base (little less than a million) and nothing else. This is not a very good measurement of how the company plays a key role in the economy of UK.

Regarding NEET- I feel that yes McD might help them to an extent, but we need to wait for at least 5 years to see the real difference. For all you know, these kids might never want to be helped. There are lots of other psychological factors that come into play. Anyway, I think one thing is clear- I should be looking at this new move of offering accredited training course exclusively and not let it be clouded by my personal feelings regarding the corp.

First pass, I am not standing up for McD or anything. But fair is fair and every argument - every balanced argument - should see things in their completeness. It is not easy to do which is why reductionism is so appealing to so many.

Further I do not believe companies work in isolation. If you are familiar with the history of smoking and the growth of fast food etc - history of public health is replete with examples - the 1960s, 1970s and 1980s were the years of hedonism where people in general were paying scant attention to the implications or long term effects of things they were indulging. These things include LSD, smoking, free sex, junk food consumption and so on. People started waking up to ill-effects of smoking in the 1970s, and the junk food thing being a bad thing only started in the 1990s. So if all this goes in the name of individual liberties, how come an organisation that capitalises on the market opportunity is evil, with the benefit of hindsight? In a liberal society, should individuals not be responsible for their own choices? There is plenty of information available and plenty of awareness around, as BRFSS data shows, but very little changes in lifestyle effected by people.

On that cringing, I think your middle class values are leading you to judge them. How do you know what they will eat, for instance? If you do not dress the salad, McD salads are amongst the cheapest around and given their portions, quite filling. You can also have an orange juice, coffee, remove the bun (and have an equivalent of 1/4 pound of red meat) but you have to know what you are doing. I would suggest an experiment - go to a McD and see if you can build a healthy meal from their menu. I think you will be surprised. You may turn around and ask why *I* do not go to McD. Well, where I live, the nearest McD is 3 miles away. It is immensely easier for me to eat something I have in the fridge than go to McD. Besides I am more lazy than I am ‘chatori’!

If the caloric bang for the buck is greater in McD and similar places, and not in supermarkets flogging fresh produce, the issue clearly goes beyond just McD, don’t you agree? Besides the lack of skills in cooking - again an individual issue - means that many people rely on these ready-to-eat things for their meals. We could argue about the cause and effect till the cows come home (unless they have all been burgered!).

As for economic contribution of McD in the UK, see this post from my Ob blog:
http://obesityheadlines.wordpress.com/2008/01/09/so-near-yet-so-far/

A link in there will tell you a lot about McD’s recent UK performance. Did you know that outside the US, the most profitable country for them is France? Yes, that mecca of culinary excellence and snobbery!

Re 16-18 versus 16-25, I have recently taught a media case study and the 16-25 figure is somehow in my head. You are right. It is 16-18 and not 16-25. Fully 11% of them are NEETs. The numbers may be small but those in this stratum may not get education or have any skills, but they are more likely to contribute to crime, teen pregnancies and welfare dependency. So their cost to the economy are considerable. I have seen recently figures to the tune of £5B or so per year being bandied about.

The point of seeking government approval is also for local market reasons. Accredited qualifications esp in vocational or ’skill’ type jobs are more likely to get people jobs and make their slightly better wages. Nobody would come to McD if they did not see an implicit benefit. Some of these people will definitely find jobs in McD but some will go on to work in the broader food and catering industry. In that respect, their skills will end up making an economic contribution to the UK economy. The government also is not averse to co-opting business organisations in sharing this “skilling” responsibility. This sort of public-private partnerships are a growing mode of addressing larger social problems.

Actually, you’re right. I should have said that they originated in the US, but since then, they’ve become a global corporation.

Network Rail, the company that maintains our rail tracks, is also going to offer a course in track engineering.

Thanks for that information. So, McD is not the first corporation to do this. Shefaly, I did a small search on NEET (the term is new to me) and I learned that the term only applies to people betn. the age of 16 and 18, and not 16-25. So, if we consider the number of kids who was between the age of 16 and 18, then the number will be quite small, no?

So McD and others are playing a key role in the economy in the UK.

Could you find an approx. figure of their contribution to the UK economy? I’ve been sifting through their Consolidated Income Statement and Cash Flow Statement and they haven’t given the break up of their income country wise. Most of the companies don’t mention this in their annual statements. I can only find consolidated figures. So…I wouldn’t be so quick to say that McD plays a “key” role in the economy in the UK.

I didn’t cite other corporations because I’m not aware of them. That’s the reason I asked you if you could tell me the precise background behind such a move. I couldn’t (and still) don’t see the point of seeking Govt approval for starting a training course that will eventually lead to a job. Such a training course can lead to a job even without the Govt. certification, right? People who receive such a cert. from McD probably won’t find a job elsewhere. That’s my main gripe. But that’s just me.

Besides, I find it surprising that you are standing up for McD- a corp. that has done more harm health wise than probably any other fast food joint. Maybe I’m being prejudiced here…I don’t know. Just today I was standing in a line at a grocery shop to pay my bill. There were some people in front of me who were casually saying “We’ll have our dinner at McD..right?”. I almost cringed.